The Fate of Canada Rests in the Hands of its People, As it Should | Tom Marazzo

April 7, 2022

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Our viewers may recognize Tom as one of the spokespeople for the Freedom Convoy in Ottawa. Tom is retired from the Canadian military and, up until September 2021, he taught at Georgian College. Tom is running as a provincial candidate in the Peterborough-Kawartha riding representing the Ontario Party. He is here today to discuss the state of our country and how we take it back.

On What our Government is Actively Doing to Us…

Every once in a while, I go back and I look at that Yuri Bezmenov a video, just to watch it again and to say, yep, we’re right there…there’s four phases of demoralization in any context. You can see it literally unfolding in North America, as you get to the third and fourth phase, those timelines really start to speed up. I think we’re at the third of four phases right now, based on what [Yuri] was saying…Yuri had actually come to Canada in the 80’s, as a former Russian KGB guy involved in propaganda [but he] defected and began working for the CBC in the Russian television programming. The first step that he talked about, is demoralization but you have to understand, it’s very subtle. It means de-moral-ize take the ‘moral’ away from a group of people. And he says that phase takes up to 20 years to literally de-moral-ize.

On the Misuse of the Emergencies Act in Ottawa….

The Charter came into effect to enshrine our freedoms. It is a legal document that was meant to say that you, as a Canadian citizen born, or otherwise, you have an inalienable right and it means you cannot lose that, that is the whole purpose…you cannot have your rights taken away [because of a virus]. We’ve enshrined that into our constitution as a country. We have this provision that talks about you can temporarily suspend it, but there’s also the Oakes test. [Only when] there is a clear threat to the loss of this country, to the…federal government’s ability to remain as a governing body…a virus cannot do that. You can still be the premier, the prime minister, even though there’s a virus. There’s no threat to the loss of this country’s governing or governance, but yet they’re selling it to the public as if the government has the right to take away your rights and freedoms somehow.

On What Canada Needs to Do Next….

Start learning how governments actually work in this country. Get involved. This is going to be the most important election in Ontario…If we, as a province can take control of our politics, we have a chance to get out of this. But it’s when people disengage from it and they abdicate their own personal responsibility, then we fail as a nation. [We need] citizens that are going to fight to take back control in this province…to stay engaged…cast your ballot, and then hold yourself accountable and hold the politicians accountable as well. We really can win back being a truly free people. We really need to get the control first, fix everything that’s broken…there’s been a lot of damage…the final phase of this is going to be where we come together and find a way to heal because we need that.

people, police, country, government, ottawa, talking, quebec, ontario, canada, freedom, military, province, ai, police officers, dehumanizing, ruled, absolutely, mandates, un troops, tom
Tom Marazzo, Will Dove

Will Dove 00:17
My guest today, many of you will recognize Tom Marazzo, who was a spokesperson for the freedom convoy. He’s not a trucker himself. In fact, his background is in education and the military. He has an MBA in negotiations, and therefore was a natural choice to be the spokesperson. He served in the Canadian military in various capacities for 25 years until his retirement in 2015. He then took a four-year degree in software development and taught for two years at Georgetown University before being fired last September for refusing to take the vaccines. And he’s here with us today to share his insights on the freedom Conboy, the emergency measures act, and what’s happening in our country. Furthermore, Tom is currently running for MPP, under the Ontario party. Tom, thank you for joining us.

Tom Marazzo 01:05
Thanks for having me on the show. Big fan. And I’m pretty excited to be here.

Will Dove 01:10
Well, thank you so much, Tom. So as I said to you before, I don’t want to get into a play by play of what happens during the freedom club that’s been done to death. Yes. So what I’m really interested in is your perceptions. And I want to start with a statement that you made in another interview, where we were watching footage of the supposed police, and you made the comment. They’re carrying AR fifteens. These are military assault rifles with silencers on them. And the reason why I want to get into that is because there’s been a whole lot of conjecture about the idea that UN troops were brought in to enforce the illegal mandates. But you have a different perspective on that. Please tell us what you think was happening.

Tom Marazzo 01:49
So the RCMP back in the early 90s had their ERP or emergency response team, basically, their national level SWAT team, and their objective was to or responsibility was to handle domestic terrorism. You know, things that we had seen over the years where there was hostage thing. So think back to the Iranian embassy siege in the 80s. When you know, the SHS did the assault on the Iranian embassy. And so Canada has its own team, and it fell under the responsibility of the RCMP. In around 1993 94. Maybe the military took over those duties and responsibilities from the RCMP when they created a unit called JTF to JTF to had that mandate, they took it over, but there’s always still been an RCMP, er T. That still takes up some of this responsibility. And so what we saw in Ottawa was actually the RCMP with all of that military grade hardware. In they got the call to come in and help the Ottawa police under the emergency act. So they were law enforcement, they were RCMP officers. But yeah, I walked up I remember looking at it thinking, why are you guys here in this capacity with that type of hardware, like, you know, full assault rifles with silencers on them? Chest rigs, you know, level for plating in full, you know, 30 round magazines for those automatic weapons against unarmed, non violent, nonviolent protest. To me, it was excessive. I mean, the entire thing in my mind was excessive, but that was a whole new level of excessive to have them there, right behind the line of Quebec police and OPP just completely over the top. Like, I just can’t even understand why they were there.

Will Dove 04:03
So the CRJ aircraft that landed in North Bay, Ontario un markings on them. Yeah. at a military base. Yes. But you don’t you don’t think that that was bringing in UN troops, you think that there was a perfectly nice reason for those planes to be there?

Tom Marazzo 04:15
Yeah, so it’s not outside the realm of, you know, normal duties for a United Nations aircraft, full un markings to be landing at a Canadian Forces Air Force Base. I would have been a little more concerned or had my eye on that a little more had had those been something like a C17 or C130 aircraft that is meant to bring soldiers and equipment into a theater of operations. But the fact that it was a civilian type of an aircraft, more of a, you know, a moody jetliner kind of thing. I wasn’t very concerned about that at all. That you to me seem like day to day operations. Now, it’s important for people to understand that the United Nations themselves do not have their own standing military. They take soldiers from member countries. So, you know, for example, Bosnia Herzegovina in the early days in 1991, when that country erupted into a civil war, the United Nations immediately got involved. And so what they did is amongst the member nations of the UN, Canada being one of them, they asked the government of Canada to contribute, members of their military are units from the military and create a task force specifically to go to Bosnia, for that specific mission, and, you know, we saw that with throughout the entire history of the UN, that’s how they operate, they don’t have a standing military, what they have is new missions that come up under the UN Charter. And then they start to build a task force from their member nations. It’s not only that, but they also do the same thing with police. They take we call them simple civilian police, that go on United Nations missions as well RCMP and other police jurisdiction. So it’s not, it’s not unusual to see the aircraft they’re in on a military base. But, you know, in terms of there was a lot of talk while we were there about un soldiers, UN troops being there. It’s like, they don’t have their own standing military, what they have is, you know, member nations of the UN that contribute soldiers and police to a specific mission.

Will Dove 06:40
So what you’re saying is that the UN would have had to have voted. Yes, have another nation bring in troops. She has to do this. So when I was interviewing Jody Leger with and she was there on the front lines, and you yourself, were standing all 10 or 15 feet away when those people got trampled by the horses. Yes. But Jody was talking about that there were police in riot gear faces covered probably the same guys that we’re talking about here in these AR fifteens. And that they would not respond to questions. And her theory was, well, it’s because they’re UN troops from another country. They don’t understand English. Right. But we were talking before the interview, and you gave me what seems now and I have to confess, folks, I myself was very seriously considering this theory that these were UN troops that have been brought in. But since talking to you, Tom, I think that you’ve given a much more reasonable and rational explanation. Would you please give me your view of these police? Who wouldn’t respond to questions? Right.

Tom Marazzo 07:33
So I was there, and I was right up to them. And I noticed they did have one badge on their shoulder, and it had the Florida Lee. And that’s I went up and I saw it. And I confirm that these are not UN troops. They’re actually Quebec provincial police. So there was a video that was going around just over a year ago. And I kind of never seen them before. And I sent the video off to a friend of mine who’s from Quebec, and I said, What do you know about these guys? Because there’s a lot of rumors flying about them. And, and I’m not 100% sure myself, and he said, No, that’s, that’s ridiculous. Those are Quebec provincial police. Because in Ontario, we have OPP and Quebec has its own version of provincial level police. And I believe they’re the only two provinces that have their own provincial level police. And so that’s who they were and, of course, you know, Quebec has different rules and regulations around their policing than let’s say, the rest of the rest of Canada. And I think it’s related to the Charter. And so what you were seeing is police officers, working side by side with Ontario Provincial Police, and RCMP. And, you know, they were they were wearing their style of uniform which is appropriate for the province of Quebec. But they did have insignia from the province of Quebec on their the badge that they were wearing on their shoulder. And I also confirm that with Alexa Lavoie from Rebel Media, because we were standing beside each other and I asked her about it. She said, Yeah, they’re Quebec police, they are Quebec Provincial Police.

Will Dove 09:08
So then the very reasonable explanation for why some of these police would not respond to questions in English. It’s because they may not speak English, they may always definitely, yes,

Tom Marazzo 09:18
that’s absolutely true. Now in go know that that makes sense. And I know that there were some people there that said, Well, we were hearing something other than French I said, Well, you know, there’s a high likelihood that you’re going to find an English speaking OPP officer that might have a Eastern European accent, or you know, is from Poland, or, you know, that’s perfectly legitimate in in Quebec as well in somebody said German. Well, you know, there’s a there’s German speaking people in Quebec as well. So, you know, we got to be careful, because there are some really big rabbit holes that we can go down but I’m happy to see that people are asking the question, because I think the public does need to know. And I do really appreciate that you’re asking me because I think I’m able to provide an answer that is accurate is you could probably possibly have unless you asked one of those police officers from Quebec themselves.

Will Dove 10:17
And I have to agree, I think that your explanation makes a lot more sense than the UN troops theory. But the fact remains, and this is something that no, we agree on. In fact, most Canadians agree on that. Virtually everything our government has done the last two years, it’s been illegal. It’s been a violation of our Charter rights. And then along comes the emergency measures act. And it’s just insanely draconian. Yes. And so okay, maybe they didn’t bring in UN troops from another country. But they still brought in police from other jurisdictions. Yes. And my theory is, and you know, I’ve studied a little bit of psychology in my life. And psychologists estimate that there are two careers that tend to attract sociopaths, police and school principals, believe it or not, that’s the other one. The other one, and so they estimate is possible. And while there’s lots of good police, and I’m not slamming the police right now, because I’ve interviewed good policemen, people who’ve lost their jobs, because they stood up for what was right. Yes. But the fact remains that so that psychologists will estimate could be as many as 20% of police are sociopaths. And so my theory is they cherry picked the officers that they brought in from other provinces, specifically for that quality that these are people who get their jollies. Yeah, beating people with batons, trampling people with horses. And that that was where the brutality came from. What do you think of that theory?

Tom Marazzo 11:40
I’ve also heard similar things, but not quite to the level of, say, 20%. But here, you know, here’s some, a couple of really interesting things. I have a lot of police officer friends. So I’ve been a member of police on guard for well over a year. But when I say I’m a member, I don’t mean as a as a former police because I’ve never been a law enforcement officer. I was allowed into the chat room, because I was retired military and I am on their website, supporting them, because I believe wholeheartedly in their their mandate and what they’re doing. But I’ve gotten to know a lot of these police officers, you know, and you know, Chris VandenBosch is one of the founding members of police on guard, he’s now resigned because of all of this stuff. And he does not like the way it’s, it’s, it’s gone over the last two years. So there are a huge number of police officers within each department all across Canada that don’t believe in what their departments are doing. However, during Ottawa, what we keep hearing is that a lot of police across the different jurisdictions said, I’m not going to Ottawa, if I told her supervisors, you know, if you try to send me to Ottawa to the downtown, I’m going to call in sick that day, or I’m going to take stress leave or whatever the issue is. Some of them just said, No, I’m not doing that. And if you try to send me there, I’m not going to follow those illegal orders. So there are a lot of really virtuous police officers that understand their oath. They understand that the charter is being violated. But they’re caught in this this middle ground between losing their jobs, right, and losing the ability to feed their own families, knowing that they’re being told to obey these illegal actions on behalf of their, their cowardice, police chiefs. And I don’t mind saying that, because I think there hasn’t been a police chief across this country, anywhere that I’m aware of that has shown a shred of moral courage in any way. And I would say that to their face. I’m disgusted. I’m disappointed.

Will Dove 13:46
But I would I would agree with you wholeheartedly. Yeah. I recently interviewed a representative of a sheriff’s organization in the US. Yes, because I think that what we need in this country is our elected county sheriffs, who work for the people because the problem with these police chiefs is they’re appointed by politicians. Yes. So they do politicians who appointed them told them to do?

Tom Marazzo 14:06
Yeah, and, you know, we got a great example in Ottawa with the Police Chief Peter Sloly, who, you know, resigned. I believe he was forced out. I you know, I don’t know the background of that, but it seems very suspicious to me that after the blow up of Diane Dean on the Police Services Board, the rhetoric that was coming out of out of her, her mouth was just stunning to everybody. And, and I think he was in a very tough situation himself. My guess is he finally had enough and push back and they said, Well, you’re gone. You’re going to leave, and he resigned, but I think he was probably pushed out. And that’s just, you know, me making my own assumptions. But, you know, there are a lot of police that said, No way I’m not doing that. But there’s also, you know, to probably talk about your 20%. That said, Yeah, sure, I’ll

Will Dove 15:06
do it. I don’t have a problem with it. Right.

Tom Marazzo 15:09
And that’s the disturbing thing, because I think that number is much higher than the police that are saying, No, this is unconstitutional, and I’m not going to violate people’s rights. Now, another interesting thing about Ottawa, the City of Ottawa was the first to declare a state of emergency. Okay, but let me back up a little bit. Our, our issue or the thing that people like from a legal point of view, because justice McLean, ruled that we had a right to be here on the horn injunction. But these are parking violations. This is MTO stuff, Ministry of Transportation stuff. This is what really, that’s the laws that that were, let’s say the bylaws that were violated, okay, parking, this is a parking infraction thing. So city of Ottawa, this declares a state of emergency, then Doug Ford, the Premier of Ontario, declares a state of emergency. Then on top of that, three weeks into it, the small fringe minority of misogynist with unacceptable views, was no longer tolerated because they grew so massive and so outspoken against what was going on that then they invoked the emergency act. Right. So for parking violations, you know, in to this day, I’m disappointed because I see a lot of stuff on social media, where people have this completely wrong idea about what it was like to be in Ottawa. And every time I’m asked a direct question, I say, Were you there? Did you go to Ottawa yourself? Or are you just really parroting what the CBC programmed you to believe? And, you know, there, it’s tough, because when we talk about policing, there are a lot of really outstanding virtuous police officers that joined to serve their communities. And I can think of one, Erin Howard, in Durham, she did a Tiktok video supporting the convoy. And now, you know, unfortunately, she did it in uniform, and now her police service is going after her. Because she openly in her uniform, supported the condyle. So we see people like that on the insight that are saying, hey, you know, this is not right, this is not okay. Unfortunately, those people are never going to be promoted within their departments, they’re going to be demoted, or they’re going to be investigated, they’re going to be sanctioned, and punished. And so my concern is a lot of the really good virtuous police that we have everywhere, are never going to rise to the to the top of the food chain in their department, because the bad ones are going to make it to the top and make sure that the good ones don’t get there. You know, we need more virtuous police. We need less of these thugs like this new guy. Who’s in charge of the Ottawa police department right now like this, this man i. Yeah. You know, right. I’m, he’s disturbing to me.

Will Dove 18:15
Yeah. It’s a very interesting observation that you’re making a very valid one that, I mean, I made that amendment statement. They were cherry picking the sociopathic police officers, but it really wouldn’t even be necessary because all they have to do is say we need officers to go Yeah, and wait for the volunteers.

Tom Marazzo 18:32
Yeah. And the volunteers are happy to go in, like we talked about before. We, you know, we had a relationship with the day to day Ottawa police officers that we interacted with for three weeks. Right. They were great. We consistently saw them. We spoke to them, you know, anybody who was caught on social media, you know, hugging truckers or the public, I think they were they were sanctioned by Ottawa police. But, you know, for three weeks, we had a relationship with the Ottawa police on the ground, day to day. But then when the emergency Act was declared, and they started bringing in all these outside police officers who volunteered to go or just accepted the task, and didn’t question it, you know, they followed orders. They came into Ottawa, mission focused. And they were they had no relationship with the people. So they came in with that, that mindset. And so for them, they literally gave themselves through their own mission statement within their police force to go in and attack unarmed civilians, you know, with weapons in just a massive, aggressive, violent behavior. You know, I saw the photos of people handing the police the flowers right there on the on the line. And yet, they were still kicking the living crap out of Canadian citizens and in soldiers or retired veterans. You know, we’re wearing their headdress in their metals. It’s impossible not to know who they were in the police. We’re still violently taking I’m down and beating soldiers. And no, this is this is in my mind. This is just a crime against Canadians.

Will Dove 20:07
And I think that you’ve made some very important observations, Tom talking about the fact that we’re losing the good officers, because they’re standing up for what’s right there, they’re not going to do it, I refuse to violate the rights of the people who I signed up to protect. Yes. And if we look historically, at totalitarian regimes, this is the kind of thing that happens as, as the enemy totalitarian control never happens overnight, unless you get invaded by a foreign army, it’s always step by step. And no people in history have ever had their rights taken from them, they give them up voluntarily in response to a perceived threat. So it’s always this gradual process. And the tyrants need the cooperation of the enforcers. Without them, they can’t enforce their legal mandates the rules. And so what happens is, you get these good police officers and good military, who will say, I’m not doing it. Yeah, they get fired, or they quit. And what are you left with what you’re left with the sociopaths, you’re perfectly happy to beat the crap out of their own people. Yep. And this gets into what’s going on in Canada right now we’re ruling as long

Tom Marazzo 21:09
as they can just describe what you just described is 1933. And they were at the time known as brown shirts. Yes. That’s what the that’s what we had in Ottawa is a group of people that were brown shirts that couldn’t see the big picture, you know, just could not understand. And I remember, I went over just before the lady was trampled with the horse. And I saw a whole group of OPP, and I was yelling at them. And I said, Thank you, you should be proud, I was clapping at them saying you should be proud of yourselves, for being so willing to take my children’s future from them. You know, you should really go home and be proud of the work that you’re doing to your country today. And they looked at me, all of these OPP looked at me, and I could see I know when somebody wants to harm me. And what I saw coming from this group of OPP, were a bunch of people that literally would have shot me that if they had the choice. Yeah.

Will Dove 22:06
And that’s, yeah, they’re brown shirts, they’re brown shirts. And if they can’t

Tom Marazzo 22:09
see that, then I and I’ve said to some of them before, if you don’t understand the big picture, what’s really, really going on here, please don’t ever try to apply to become a detective, because you don’t have what it takes.

Will Dove 22:20
And I’ve had a similar experience myself, where I said to an officer who was it wasn’t after me at the time that somebody else and but he knew who I was with, it was a demonstration. I said, my kids are damn proud of me for what I’m doing to stand up for their rights and freedoms. And I looked at the guy says, When this is over, what are your children going to think of you? Yeah, and I got the same look, you did? Yep. I don’t know. Screw you. I don’t care. And you know, we’d get in my way again, and I’ll arrest you. Yeah, well look,

Tom Marazzo 22:53
your investment off. You’ve probably seen the videos from the 80s. Your investment off was the the former Russian KGB guy involved in propaganda. He had actually come to Canada in the 80s. He defected from the USSR, and was working for the CBC in the Russian television programming. And he had talked about this in the first step that he talked about, he said is demoralization. Now, we in our context, we look at it and say well, demoralized. We think Oh, demoralization, we’re sad, you know, I’m demoralized today. Because, you know, I didn’t I didn’t get the raise I got so I’m demoralized. But in his context, you have to understand you got to be it’s very subtle. It means de mer. More lies, like, take the moral away from the group of people. And he says that phase takes up to 20 years to literally de moralize, take the morals away from that society. And you can see this and every once in a while, I go back and I look at that URI basement off video just to watch it again. And to say, yep, we’re right there, because there’s four phases of it. And you can see it literally unfolding in North America, what’s happened in the there’s four phases. And as you get to the third and fourth phase, those timelines really start to speed up. And I think we’re at the three of four feeds right now based on what he was saying.

Will Dove 24:18
And it’s another great observation because earlier I was talking about sociopaths. And one of the reasons why I got into studying that abnormal psychology is people throw well in the term psychopath and sociopath a lot and I was just curious what what’s the difference? I started studying there just kept going. But here, here in a nutshell, is the difference. psychopaths are born. sociopaths are made. Yes. So the process you just talked about. D moralization process. Yes. Is the process of taking a large segment of any population and gradually turning them into sociopaths. Yes. Yeah. People who look and have no concern for other people at all.

Tom Marazzo 24:53
Yeah, look at soldier training. In police training. We use video game type of have training, right where we’re dehumanizing the shooter. Right? So we have a figure 11, we call it a figure 11. In the military that we shoot at the range, it’s the silhouette of a human being. Right, and we, we train our soldiers to, to dehumanize our enemy. Right. And when you look at people that are covered up, we lose empathy in the in the researchers that psychologists have been studying masks in the fact that we’re, we’re literally dehumanizing our young generation of other people. I mean, when you can’t see facial expression, it’s really hard to, to have empathy or to learn empathy. Right. And this is like the foundation of what it means to be human, or in our ability to work together in love one image of one another. And so when we’re taking young children’s lives, I have a very young child, she’s six years old, right? She has for you know, two thirds of her life, not seeing people’s faces in public, or 1/3 of her life. Right. So she is she is actively being seeing other human beings from a demoralizing or dehumanizing perspective.

Will Dove 26:12
And I just want to jump in on that, because it’s very fortunate that your daughter is six. Yes. Jordan Peterson, not in his books – in one of his talks, I heard he talks about how if a child is not properly socialized by the age of four, they never will be. Yeah, you can’t fix the damage after that point. So what we’ve got anybody right now who has a child four years old or younger? That child has had permanent psychological, social damage done to them, by these mask mandates, because they’ve spent the majority of their developmental years when they should have been learning to socialize with other people unable to see other people’s faces. Yes. Your daughter is just old enough that she’s probably going to be okay. If you know. But yeah, it’s absolutely horrible what they’re doing. And they’re using all of this psychology against us. And I wanted to get into that with the emergency measures, because we were talking about that a few minutes ago. And we don’t need to belabor the point that there was no justification for the emergency measures act, it is there. In cases where the nation’s security or safety is being threatened. A group of truckers parked in Ottawa is hardly a threat to national security. Everybody knows that. That was there was no justification for it whatsoever. And before the interview, I shared with you my own theory about what was going on with that, because I’ve been talking about the psychology that’s being used as being seen used by the globalists who are behind all of this, ever since the beginning, they’ve been using psychology very, very effectively to manipulate people into giving up their rights. And so here is what I think happened with the Emergencies Act. The Freedom Convoy was attracting far too much attention, not just in Canada, but globally. And I’m, you know, I’m in touch with some freedom leaders around the world. And everybody wants to know what’s going on with the freedom convoy, you know, tell us what’s going on there. And so the globalist looked at this and they said, is gathering far too much attention, we have to shut it down. But we want to shut it down in a way where it’s not going to cost us any ground that we’ve gained. Yes. And so what they do is they get Trudeau under their orders to bring in the Emergencies Act, then use that as an excuse to do these absolutely draconian tyrannical measures of bringing in, they know that old tactic, bring in police from elsewhere who are not connected to the people there and use them, brutalize them and drive them out. And then and I think I think that the globalist would have been thrilled if Chrystia Freeland had gotten her way, and it’d become permanent. But I also think they didn’t count on it. They didn’t count it right from the beginning, they figured the Senate would kill it, something would kill it. You know, a lot of people think as you do, it’s because of the run of the banks that killed it. Yes. But it doesn’t matter, because it has served its purpose. And now Trudeau rescinds it and the nation celebrates as though we’ve won something. But we didn’t win anything. The truckers still don’t have their rights back. Yeah. And most of us who are who are aware of what’s going on are looking at the provinces that are dropping their mandates right now and saying, well, all they’re doing is just making room for the federal mandates that are coming. Yeah, we haven’t gained anything. Yes. But they use this psychology against us. What do you think of all that?

Tom Marazzo 29:10
Nothing has changed. You know, Ontario lifted their mask mandates, I think on the on the 21st. And you talked about the psychological effect. I went to the mall last night with my family and the majority of the people in the mall, were still wearing their masks. Right. And I find it so curious, because over and over and over the government said follow the science, follow the science follow the science over and over and over and over. And now we’ve got the reverse where the government said, Okay, our science is telling us it’s okay for you to breathe oxygen through your mouth and nose again. And yet now people don’t believe them. So, you know, we’re again upside down in this whole this whole issue, you know, and that’s a psychological conditioning you do the mainstream media who is funded by the taxpayer. It’s a web in that the taxpayers fund that is used on the taxpayers themselves, is really what the mainstream media is. And they’ve done such an outstanding job. And they’ve created so much fear and confusion that the public no longer believes their captor anymore. You know, it’s the most bizarre form of Stockholm Syndrome I’ve ever experienced in my life, that the public doesn’t believe the government about the masks. But yet the public doesn’t believe the people that are saying things are about to get a whole lot worse. You’re a conspiracy theorist. If you say that, yeah. It’s really, really bizarre. And we always hear the term cognitive dissonance and stuff. But this is this is to a whole new level in my mind. I feel bad for the people that are walking around in the mask for the simple reason their lives are being ruled by unnecessary fear. You know, in the truck convoy didn’t do that. The government of their municipalities, their public health organizations, the province of Ontario under Doug Ford, and Andrea Horvath, and the Liberals are pumping this constant message of fear and terror. And then you’ve got, you know, Justin Trudeau with his rhetoric and stuff and the government has – is so lost, they are so lost at every level in this country. It’s really disheartening, I gotta say, like, it sometimes it takes a lot of strength just to get out of bed.

Will Dove 31:41
I know. And we were discussing this before the interview that, really, it’s not our government anymore, can’t it’s no longer it’s not ruled by Canadians anymore. We live essentially an occupied country, where our politicians are being controlled by a foreign power where it’s immediacy, Trudeau doesn’t even try to hide the fact that he was basically a protege of Klaus Schwab, in order to Freeland. This is public knowledge. Yeah. And so what we’ve got is we’re living in an occupied territory. And people still think that somehow the Canadian government’s going to come to their senses and give us our rights back.

Tom Marazzo 32:18
Yeah. Yeah,

Will Dove 32:19
that’s the Canadian government’s not running things anymore.

Tom Marazzo 32:21
They’re not is that a whole bunch of stuff? I’d love to be able to unpack. But I don’t you know, I don’t think we have eight hours.

Will Dove 32:28
Well, but take 10 minutes. Yeah, I’d like to hear your thoughts on it.

Tom Marazzo 32:33
So there’s a there’s something that you said that really stuck out the most for me, is the government is not going to give us our freedoms back. And this is the this is the central problem to me, is that we have this Charter in, you know, the Charter came into effect to enshrine our freedoms, it is a legal document that was meant to say that you as a Canadian citizen born or, you know, given Canadian citizenship, you have an inalienable right. And it means you cannot lose that right. That is the whole purpose of something that is inalienable to you. You cannot have your right taken away. We’ve enshrined that into our Constitution as a country. That’s what legitimizes all of our laws, and all of our political structure. We have this provision under Section One that it talks about that you can you can temporarily suspend it. And temporarily, but there’s also the Oakes’ test, and I’m sure the viewers by now have heard about this Oakes’ test. And there’s a word in the, you know, in that provision, it says demonstrably, okay, it means you must demonstrate there is a clear threat to the loss of this country, to the loss of the federal government’s ability to remain as a governing body in this country. A virus can’t do that. A virus cannot do that. You can still be the Premier, the Prime Minister even though there’s a virus. And so there’s no threat to the loss of this country’s governing, or governance. But yet they’re selling it to the public as if the government has the right to take away your rights and freedoms somehow. And to treat you like a criminal if you don’t abide by what these people in government are saying like it none of it has ever made sense. It does not fall in line, but the public is ignorant. They’re absolutely ignorant to these facts. And here’s one of the things that upsets me, because I spoke at a potluck that we had inside the riding that I’m trying to get elected in. And I went on and I talked about as a citizen, we need to share some of the responsibility of the situation that we’re in, because we don’t know what governance is in this country. We don’t know how laws are created. We don’t understand the mechanisms of government. And we have to, we have to accept a small measure of responsibility for that, because we’ve allowed our politics to become more like a What’s the power of attorney? We’ve allowed our politicians to act in a manner that’s more in line with the power of attorney, I cast my ballot, therefore, I’m abdicating my responsibility for the governance in this country.

Will Dove 35:30
Abdication, I think is exactly the right word. People have abdicated their responsibility of self governance, yes, by handing it over to somebody else, and just blindly trusting that they’re gonna use it wisely.

Tom Marazzo 35:41
Yes and second to that, the government’s know this the political parties know this. And so they take advantage of our ignorance. And they do stuff because they know that we’re not going to watch and they know that if individuals speak out, they can just call you names like conspiracy theorist or marginalize you really quickly. And now your friends and family just what that phrase will turn on you. But if you do it in large groups, then it starts to get some oxygen, right. So you know, as a as a society, we’ve taken our eye off the ball, but the people that we’re supposed to be watching know that we’re not watching. And so they do these things behind our backs. And in you know, we are if you look at the World Economic Forum, it’s no secret. You know what I mean? Like Klaus Schwab himself has the video. It’s gone around in, he’s saying, I’ve, we’ve infiltrated at least half of the Canadian cabinet, right? Chrystia Freeland is on one of their boards like this is — they’re all on the website. Like there’s, there’s deliberate things, they’re like, the connections are there, this is not a conspiracy. This is actual fact. So, you know, we are in deep trouble. We are in a lot of trouble in this country, because we have disengaged from the political decisions that people are making on behalf of our lives. And then I find it a little frustrating that we as Canadians complain about politicians, when we ourselves are not politically active or engaged. Right? Yeah. And, you know, second to that, the politicians, the parties have gotten very, very accustomed to just ignoring protests. They just literally close the windows, close the door, and they ignore you, and they do what they were going to do anyway. There could be 10,000 people up front at Queen’s Park, they’re not going to answer the door. They’re not going to care. They just continue down the road that they always do because they know that a protest has no ability and what do they do they call you a fringe minority.

Will Dove 37:43
Yeah. And we’ve got people who are blind to the globalist agenda, because they’ve got this, this dystopian science fiction-y idea of what the global government would look like, is somehow going to be big brother, and all national borders will disappear. That’s not how they’re going to do it. What they’re going to do is do exactly what they’re doing in Canada, they’re going to infiltrate the federal governments and control the nations of the world that way. Yes. You know, on the surface, it’s all gonna look the same. Yep. Our government, people, the governments of countries around the world and Canada is already there. They’re not calling the shots anymore. They’re not working for Canadians. Yeah, the rule of law doesn’t matter. Tyranny is completely okay. And as you say, the people aren’t doing anything about it. Which brings me to the very important point, you are doing something about it, you’re running for MPP for the Ontario Party. Yes. And I think that’s extremely important. Because if we can fix this, it has to be from the bottom up. We have to replace our civic councils, we have to replace our provincial governments, with people who actually will work for the people’s rights. And eventually that’s going to filter up at the federal level, where we can kick the globalist out and take our country back. What do you think of that?

Tom Marazzo 38:56
So, you know, there’s a phrase I’ve heard from a close friend of mine, who was in Ottawa with me, and he says, you know, Local Action has National Impact. Okay. And it’s, it’s local, get involved with your school boards, and let’s get rid of this woke ism stuff in the classrooms. That’s gotta go. Let’s actually within our school system in our school board start actually talking about in teaching governance. Okay, how does a law in this country get made? Why? Why does a 14 or 15 year old person in this country not know that at this point, right, so we’ve got to get involved at our local level, to make a national impact. And, you know, the idea going around now in our cultural system is somehow that the Canadian flag is a symbol of racism. This, this baffles me. This is a direct assault on our education system in our culture as as a people who built this country to what it really is. And so that is one small example at the very local level, get involved in the education system get involved in the political system. But here’s the issue. So for me, I looked at what level of government would I have the best impact. And when you look at the provincial government issues, all municipalities are corporations. And that corporation derives its power from the province. So if a municipality goes against the provincial government, they actually have the legal authority in the power to dissolve a municipal government and take custodianship of that entire municipality. So I didn’t want to be at a level where I didn’t have autonomy. So there’s no federal election right now. I’m not entirely sure that I’m interested at the federal level, I think my fight right now is at the province, because especially the province of Ontario, if we can make the change for the province of Ontario, we have 14 million people in this province of a country population of 38 million. Typically, the Federal results come from Ontario, right in Toronto has a big impact federally on where the election results come from. So I think for me, we get the change in Ontario, then we’re going to be able to impact the federal changes that we want down the road as well. So it’s important for me, because I really, it took me a full week to decide if I was going to run for Provincial politics. And it took me honestly, I, I spoke to a lot of people, a lot of people, I got a lot of good advice. And it really came down to a couple of things for me. I can do activism, like I’ve been doing with the Convoy. And you can only get so far, because they again, they just shut the curtain they go about their day, which is what we saw in Ottawa, if if they would have just talked to us, you know, that would have probably had a different result, but they had no interest in talking to people. So Doug Ford is famous for never engaging with any of the protests, either, unless it’s BLM, right, unless it’s something that helps him with his voter base, but he’s not going to talk to people that are fighting for freedom, he’s going to talk to BLM. Okay. So when you look at sort of the big picture, where can I do this, so if I’m, if I’m on the inside, if I’m elected as an MPP, I can do things within the government, and I can still do the activism. So I can do both. So I think I’m going to do the very best I can to get elected, to get more members to get the Ontario Party elected. And get inside and start getting the change that we really need to see. And I’ve said on Twitter, I said, I don’t think we need to take back Canada, Canada is already it is ours, what we have to do is take control of government, because that’s what’s out of control. It’s not Canada, we are Canada, the people are Canada, we make up this country. So let’s not take back Canada, let’s take back control of our governance, because that is grossly out of control.

Will Dove 43:15
Very well. So yes, Canada is not a chunk of land, is the people. And the people unfortunately have abdicated their responsibility to take control over who gets to make our decisions. Yeah. And income involved in that.

Tom Marazzo 43:29
Yeah, these these, you know, this woke ism. This is not about fighting racism. It is a bait and switch. You know what it is? It’s, it’s absolutely about division. It has met, its objective. You know, in the military, you have something called an effects based operation. What are you trying to affect as a result of what you’re doing now, woke ism is an effects based operation, where the intent is to create division. And when there’s division, it’s easy to conquer, right in the hearts and minds of Canadians are being divided and conquered. And we know this because we’re seeing families getting ripped apart. Husbands and wives are on the opposite ends of the spectrum in terms of vaccinations, and lock downs, and truck convoys, and freedom. Right? We’re seeing this all across this country. Now, to further divide people. Let’s say, Let’s go after the Canadian flag. Let’s go after Caucasians. Let’s go after, you know, other different interest groups. Let’s just divide everybody is possible as much as possible put a mask on their face and let everyone be dehumanized. Yeah, exactly. This is, this is how we’re so easily manipulated.

Will Dove 44:43
And you’re absolutely right. And I love your observations about that because before you were talking about the brown shirts in Germany, well the other thing that Hitler did that brilliant, evil, but brilliant, was the Hitler Youth. Yes. And that’s what we’re seeing today, in our society in our schools. systems is, as you say, they’re dividing people. They’re forcing kids into these little micro communities if you have your own little weird identity, I mean, this is what the non binary movement is all about. Yes, convincing girls that it’s not okay to be a girl that you have to you can’t identify as a gender. Well, what does that do to them? It robs them of their identity. Yes. So if you don’t know who you are, how in the world, can you then be part of a larger community? Because if you don’t know who you are, by definition, if you don’t fit in anywhere?

Tom Marazzo 45:29
Yes, absolutely. I couldn’t agree more with that, you know, in how we’re manipulated is the fact that humans inherently do want to do good. They want to support their communities, they want to support their families, they want to do the right thing they want that they crave it to be a good citizen of their country in their society. So when there’s a movement, there’s a there’s a way to get involved and show support to with this belief that we want to have a better world, people will jump on board with that. Right? And I’ve been asked several times, what do I think about Ukraine? And my answer is, I don’t think about Ukraine. it’s not my fight. My fight is the Canadian government at all levels. And as awful as war is, there are wars all over this planet. You know, does anyone know about what’s happening in Nicaragua? Does anyone know about especially what’s happening in the Sudan? Does anyone care about any of the other countries? No, but the news media is telling you to start wearing the Ukrainian flag all over your your stuff? Right? Right. I sympathize with everybody who is in a war zone, because war is absolutely hell. And it is the worst kind of humanity that we have. But I’m not going to be distracted by this particular conflict because the CBC tells me I need to be distracted by it. And I’m actually preoccupied with my own problems with my own tyrannical governments that are not really even governments, they’re proxy governments controlled by outside interests. And so I am going to stay focused on Ontario, and then on the federal government. And once we get control of politics here, it’s like saying, you know, if we have a flood in the area, and my basements flooded, and your basements flooded, do I give you my pump? Right? I stabilize my own situation. And then I go over and I help my neighbor.

Will Dove 47:38
Yeah. Put the mask on yourself on the airplane before you put it on your kid. Because if you pass out, you can’t help them. Yeah,

Tom Marazzo 47:45
Exactly. So we have to be realistic and get people to wake up. And I’ve said to people before, if you don’t really understand or believe what’s going on, go find somebody from Eastern Europe, who came from communism have a good conversation, because they’ll tell you, they’ll tell you what’s going on right here in Canada. They’ve seen this before they’ve been part of it. And I had a man come to talk to me in Toronto, last week. And he says, Listen, what’s going on here is worse than what happened in Czechoslovakia. He said, because in communism, they just tell you, you don’t have any rights. Here, they tell you they that you do have rights, but they act completely the opposite the opposite way. He says it’s much more insidious the way they do it here.

Will Dove 48:27
And I’ve interviewed several people who grew up in communist regimes escaped from them or the regime collapsed. And every single one without exception, has said the same thing. If I had a choice between going back to living under the communist regime, or living here in this country now under this tyranny, I’d go back.

Tom Marazzo 48:44
Yeah, a friend of mine has six Polish families that he knows that have gone back to Poland and a friend of mine, she’s a dentist in Toronto. She went back to Poland, her husband still in Toronto, right. And people fled Poland in the 80s to come to Canada for freedom. And now they’re heading back to Poland. Like what does that say? I mean, Poland is a great country now. But it wasn’t always so good under communist rule.

Will Dove 49:09
Tom, is there’s one last question that I wanted to ask you because you’re running for MPP. And on a very sound basis, the idea that you can make a difference on the provincial level in a province that has a huge influence over what happens at the federal level. So very good reasoning there. Something that our audience probably doesn’t know about you is that in the two years that you taught at Georgian College, you taught computer programming with a focus on teaching ethics to artificial intelligences? Yes. And I think there’s, there’s a parallel there, because, okay, you’re working on teaching a machine, ethical behavior. But what is politics but a giant machine? Yes. So yes. What do you think of that? No, it was not. It was very bad. Yes. In fact, I interviewed pastor Artur Pawlowski yesterday in one of the brief times when he wasn’t in jail. Yeah, here in Alberta. And he grew up in Poland did business in Poland. And yeah, it’s it was it was a horrible system. Yes, that was the system. It was corrupt. And everybody knew it was corrupt. And so at least you knew where you stood. Yeah, yeah. If you’re in Canada, yeah. Well, they could change the rules tomorrow. Yeah. Yeah. And probably will. They will. They will.

Tom Marazzo 50:25
Oh, you know, that’s a that’s a really good question. And it’s really interesting. And Georgian College started a one year post-graduate certificate program in artificial intelligence. And I was pretty excited about it. And when they were handing out the assignments, they gave us a list, they said, Hey, what what do you want to teach? Like, what area of that program interest you and I saw this course it’s called Issues and Challenges with Artificial Intelligence. And I jumped on that that was the first one I picked. And, and really, I looked at it from an ethical point of view: morals, right? And ethics really is derived by your society, you know, in an example, is this. Look at the Americans, morally and ethically, in the days of slavery in the United States, that was acceptable. That was the values of that society at the time, that’s no longer acceptable. So these things are evolving. But now, when we get into the future, and we’re looking at Canadian society, what are our morals and ethics as a society? And how does artificial intelligence come into play with this, in there are so many different areas that we can we can go with this. And really, I was excited, I built that course from the ground up. And I taught it twice I was when I got fired was the third iteration that I was going to go through that course, I loved it, it was the most engaging course that I had ever taught it at Georgia. And it was interesting, because the one day, we started talking about the social credit score. And one of my students was actually from China. And for the company he worked on in China, he was building an app to capture the social credit score. So it was unintentional. But it was almost like I brought in a guest speaker to talk about social credit scores, facial recognition in the surveillance state. And what’s important for people to understand is it in its in its raw is form AI, can be a very positive tool, it can be very good. But it’s where it goes off the rails that it becomes extremely dangerous. So I’ll give you an example. If, if my hands are full of stuff, and I want to get into my lock into my into my house, and I’ve got a facial recognition doorbell that says, Oh, it’s you. And they open the door for me and I just push it open. You know, that’s a great service to me from for AI. But where it goes off the rails is when that same doorknob or doorbell with the AI, gets hacked, sees me leaving my house. And the person hacking, it sees me leave, they now know my house is empty. I can be robbed. Right. So, you know, facial recognition was used in Ottawa by law enforcement. You know, we were all photograph, they had drones up in the sky, and there was people with a camera, and they’re gonna compare that to your driver’s license. Right. And that’s a case where, on one hand, if you want to fight legitimate crime, that’s great. But now on a peaceful protest, we’re all going to be investigated. By what we know to be law enforcement action against the Canadian public, that is sketchy at best, whether or not it was even legal what the law enforcement did to us, right. So these are tools that are going to be used in what could be positive and negative ways. But for me, the most terrifying thing is we are going to use AI to make decisions at a government level. And we’re not going to we’re not going to account for the ethics of what we’re doing. Because there is a there is a lot of studies in this area of AI. Because AI is biased, the human programming it or creating it builds in a bias. And so when a government turns to artificial intelligence to make decisions, are they actually accounting for the ethical issues that are going to absolutely arise in we see some of these examples were in the medical community insurance, health insurance in the United States, as an example, if you use AI algorithms to make decisions, what it does is it marginalizes it’s actually racist against visible minorities. Right? But it’s really good for let’s say, very wealthy, wealthy areas wealthy states wealthy, I don’t want to say Caucasians, because that’s not the only factor, there are many. But it becomes extremely racist in a disadvantages and marginalize certain portions of our population. based on other factors, the AI will do that, right, because it’s based on statistics. So we have to be extremely careful on how we approach AI. And when a government turns over decision making to an AI application, what they’re just doing is it you know, they sell it as efficiency. But what they do is, they end up abdicating their responsibility to an AI to make a decision that is going to affect human beings in their life, which is to be very careful —

Will Dove 55:42
— which is a very frightening thought, because we were talking 20 minutes ago about how large part of the reason we’re in this mess. Canadians abdicated their responsibility for self governance by handing it off to someone else and blindly trusting that that person would handle it in a moral way. And now we’re moving towards AI making decisions. And what happens if those AI’s have no sense of ethics whatsoever?

Tom Marazzo 56:07
Absolutely. So here’s a great example of this right? My son has an extensive medical condition, and he needed heart medication. But because my accounts were frozen, my credit cards were turned off my credit card that was on file with the drugstore for his medication, couldn’t get it. Right, couldn’t pay for it. And luckily, his mother had the cash, she had to pay out of pocket for this, this medication, right, this is life saving medication. But was there any thought on the part of the government? Was there any judge that ruled on my particular case? About the second and third order effects that were going to happen to my family, based on the government’s decision to use FINTRAC to attack my my financial assets? Was there any consideration for that? Did I, as an individual in this country, get to represent myself, because like I’ve said before, no warrant, no charges, no convictions, they went straight to punishment. For people that had a legal you know, Justice McLean ruled that we had a right to be there, it was our Charter right to be there. And yet, the government ignored the Charter. They ignored it outright. Now, let’s say we turn that kind of decision making in power over to an AI, it’s even going to be worse, because the AI has no emotional connection to the outcome or the result, right? The government who is going to create that system is just going to look at human beings as deemed, you know, unhuman automatons that it has no interest whatsoever in the actual effected on people’s day to day lives. Okay, and you saw that case where there was a woman who gave to GoFundMe, and it was it was determined that her bank account should be frozen. Like this is this was a deemed a crime long after the fact. So even before the Convoy made its way to Toronto, she had donated that money. And now, nobody ever knew that there would be the Emergencies Act after the fact. So then they went back in time, and they decided that what she did was a crime based on the fact that she just wanted to support Canadians, right? So we turn this kind of decision making over to AI in this in this country, we’re in a lot of trouble. And I have seen the government contracts that are being tendered, where we want to start using AI at the government level to make decisions. If there’s no, if there’s no human in the decision making length, then I don’t think it has a place. Yeah.

Will Dove 58:49
And you made another really good observation that you’re talking about this woman who had her accounts frozen, even though the donation she made was, you know, before the truckers ever even arrived in Ottawa, way before the Emergencies Act. And you said they decided to call it it was a crime. But really what they did was they decided to call it a crime, because we all know, it wasn’t. It was just a person exercising their rights to support a peaceful Freedom Movement. And then there’s the possibility we end up with AI’s that begin retroactively labeling people as criminals. Yes. And shutting them down. So Tom, I think we’ve covered a lot of extremely important ground. I hope I know, I know, you’ve given our viewers a lot to think about. I wanted to thank you so much for that, as a person with military experience as a person who was, you know, on the ground there through the entire Freedom Convoy as a spokesperson for them as an MBA with a focus on negotiations, and as a future I hope politician I very much wish you all the best in the election, because we need people like you in office. Final thoughts for our viewers.

Tom Marazzo 59:57
Start paying attention to go governance, start engaging. This is what I need people to do. Because I always get asked, What do we do next? What do we do next? Start learning on how governance actually works in this country, get involved. This is going to be the most important election in Ontario, in probably in their history, I believe. If we, as a province can take control of politics, of governance, we have a chance to get out of this. But it’s when people disengage from it, and they abdicate their own personal responsibility to the political structure, then we fail as a nation. And so I’ve, and I want to be careful with this term. But I’m saying if I’m going to run, I’m building an army of citizens that are going to fight to take back control of the politics in this province. And we can no longer afford for citizens to abdicate their responsibility to elected officials, they have to be engaged, they have to stay engaged, you can’t just count your cast your ballot, and think that Tom Marazzo is going to do all the heavy lifting for you, you’re going to have to, going forward in the future, to be a citizen, cast your ballot, and then hold yourself accountable and hold the politicians accountable as well. We are literally in this one together. So as long as the citizenship is, is maintained through engagement and action, we can win this, we really can win back being a free, a truly free people. And we do need to heal, we really need to get the control first, fix everything that’s broken. And then we have to start healing. Because there’s been a lot of damage done in the the final phase of this is going to be where we come together and find a way to heal, because we need that we need closure with this in the end. But we still have a long, long way to go.

Will Dove 1:02:05
Yes, we do. Well, Tom, I want to thank you so much for your insights, for your activism. And as once again, I’m sure that I speak on behalf of all of our viewers wishing you the very best of luck in the election. We need people like you taking back our country. And you’re right, absolutely. People need to stand up and be active. So thank you again. Yeah, thanks. Well, thank you

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